By James Mottram
In 2015, fifteen-year-old Arthur Cave fell from a cliff near his home in Brighton, England after taking LSD with a friend. He was rushed to Royal County Sussex Hospital, but died from his injuries. “In my opinion, even if there was a trauma team at the bottom of that cliff, it would have been very unlikely that he would have survived,” the attending doctor said in an official statement. For Arthur Cave’s parents – Australian born rock icon, Nick Cave, and model and fashion designer, Susie Bick – the blow was obviously beyond brutal. Notoriously private, Cave opted to pour his feelings into his new album with his longtime band, The Bad Seeds. But in a surprise move, Cave invited his friend – Australian filmmaker, Andrew Dominik (Chopper, The Assassination Of Jesse James By The Coward Robert Ford, Killing Them Softly) – to document the recording of what would become the long player, Skeleton Tree. And with Arthur’s death at the heart of the album, it eventually became the heart of the film too. Though initially designed as a mere album promo, the result is the lush, revealing, heart breaking, and beautifully shot (in 3D, no less) documentary, One More Time With Feeling, which will screen publicly for one day only around the world on September 8. FilmInk spoke with Andrew Dominik the day after the film’s premiere at The Venice Film Festival.
How do you know Nick? “I met him in 1986. We had a girlfriend in common, and that’s how we met basically. It was this girl called Deanna. When I started going out with her, Nick had just released a record that had a bunch of songs about her on it. They remained friends, and he would call up to talk to her, and we developed a telephone relationship. We liked each other. And we gradually got closer and closer over 30 years. He did the music for The Assassination Of Jesse James By The Coward Robert Ford, and that was the first time that we worked with each other. It’s always been a friendship more than a professional relationship. Obviously, I saw a bit of him when Arthur died. I was around. I know Nick and his family pretty well. I’m not as close to him as, say, John Hillcoat. But I think maybe that’s the reason Nick asked me to do it. Although we’re friends, I have enough distance from the situation.”
Was this originally meant to be a making-of new album type documentary? “They do this thing in England where a band plays somewhere and they broadcast it live in cinemas. That’s what he was going to do. But he wasn’t feeling it. There’s a certain amount of energy that goes into conjuring the Nick Cave persona for a performance, and he wasn’t really felling that he wanted to do that. So the idea came up to do a film. And that’s what he called me about: to make a film that was going to go into theatres and that was going to play one time. It was going to be The Bad Seeds playing the songs from the new record, which is what the film is, but that would have only been 35 minutes of material, so we had to come up with other stuff. The film evolved organically. We were winging it the whole time. Basically the film is completely improvised.”
Do you think that it was necessary that you knew him to make this documentary? “I think that it was necessary for him. I don’t think that I would have done it if it wasn’t for our personal relationship. I just basically wanted to help because I was worried about them. Some of the instinct about making this film was about protecting himself, because he realised that he was going to have to promote the record, and there was no way to talk about the record without talking about the context of the record, which was Arthur. He just didn’t feel that was something that he could do with a whole lot of strangers. So I think it was necessary that I knew him.”
Did you feel like you had to protect him? How do you feel talking to us about it now? “I feel okay. It’s not often that you are placed into a situation where something real is happening. It was a really new experience for me. When you’re making a movie, all you’re trying to do is come up with stuff that’s alive and living in front of the camera. You’re trying to fool people into not acting. But with something like this, everything that you shoot is usable…even the stuff that’s not good is usable. And that’s exciting to deal with. Also, for me, it’s the first time that I’ve gone to work and not known what I was going to be doing that day. That’s a liberating way to work.”
Did you know that Nick and his wife, Susie, were going to talk about Arthur? “No. The agreement was that he could cut anything out of the movie that he was uncomfortable with, and I would do that, but he would let me shoot anything and answer any question that I asked him. That was our deal. So that’s how we dealt with it. There’s a lot of concern about the idea of exploiting a tragedy. Is there something just off about making a film on this subject? Walking down the red carpet last night seemed incredibly inappropriate.”
You say it in the film… “I’m feeling very uncomfortable…” “Yeah, because you don’t know where the line is. Where is it a legitimate portrait of a person going through something, and where does it turn into grief porn? Does the whole thing somehow diminish a tragedy? That was my big concern. Is there something off about making this film at this moment? Nick definitely felt the same way. We were constantly worrying about where is the line, and we didn’t know. During the process, it felt like some of the things were on the wrong side.”
Did Nick tell you to cut out anything from the movie? “No. He felt uncomfortable about a lot of it, and he knew he would. He liked all the stuff with Susie, and Susie liked all the stuff with him, but they didn’t like their own stuff. So they showed it to [Cave’s regular musical collaborator] Warren [Ellis], and he basically decided what was good and bad. He asked me to change a few things. We watched it, and it was better the way that it was, so we put it back. Nick’s instinct is to try to control everything. But in a situation like this, he didn’t want to be in control of it. If he took control, he would have to take responsibility for it, and he would have to be sitting here talking to you. So he let me have my way.”
Did you prepare much before taking on the documentary? “No, it just all happened so quickly. As a friend, I wouldn’t ask Nick the questions that I would ask him as a director. And I had to be the director. There was just no time. But it happened organically. I had to go with the instinctual, gut feeling about what I was going to shoot without knowing where those ideas would lead.”
When you heard the album being put together, what did you think of it? “I really liked it. When I heard it, it was very fresh and it was very close to Arthur’s death. There were certain parts of the record that were incredibly moving because he was casting his feelings into words. And like a lot of artists, Nick is more honest in his work than he is necessarily in life.”
He’s obviously very good with emotions though… “I feel like both he and Susie are amazing in the way that they’re dealing with it. A situation like this is awful, but it also brings out the best in people. You see these incredible acts of kindness and compassion that surround the whole thing.”
In the review of the film in Variety, there was some questioning about why you didn’t mention that Arthur was under the influence of LSD when he died… “I don’t think that’s the point of the film. The Variety review implies that Arthur was some kind of troubled kid that had some problems, and that the film is somehow shying away from that. That’s not the case. I knew Arthur, and I know the family. Arthur was just a fifteen-year-old kid doing what fifteen-year-old kids do. It’s a fucking accident and it’s fucking awful. That’s just an American journalist who wants a film to behave a certain way. He’s got an idea of how a documentary should behave. I’m not sure that the film is really a documentary, it’s more like a film poem.”
If you didn’t know the backstory… “You have to understand that this is a specialised Nick Cave movie that probably turned out a bit better, so on that basis, it feels appropriate to have it at a film festival. It’s actually a cinematic experience. I’m not making this film for posterity. I’m making this film for a very specific reason: to screen it this one time at this particular year where the context of the film will be known by everyone who sees it. It might have some other life on pay TV or DVD, but I would love the idea that it played once and is never seen again. That would be awesome, and that was always the idea. It would be great. Nick paid for the film out of his own pocket, and I would like for him to recoup his investment. It’s basically to sell the record…that’s the idea of the film.”
Can you tell us more about the visuals and why you chose to shoot in 3D? “I really like 3D. I don’t necessarily like the way that it’s used in movies. To look at a person’s face in 3D is fascinating. Both 3D and black-and-white have a way of allowing you to see the world through new eyes. Things look completely different in black-and-white; you can see them, and it reveals something, and it’s also distancing. Black-and-white has an elegant distance to it. And 3D has an immersive quality. The two things are at odds with each other but kind of complimentary. I knew that the film was just going to be a series of fleeting moments. There’s nothing about it that’s resolved or that’s tied up; it’s just going to be a portrait of a person in a state of confusion. So if it’s not going to be narrative, it needs to have a way of washing over you. You need to surrender to it as an experience, so it seemed like a good way to do it.”
In the scene when Susie brings out the paintings, how close were you to tears given that you knew the family? I know that you’re doing a job, but… “I personally find the film very moving. More so when I was cutting it. Behind the camera, there are two instincts: one of them is of concern for my friend who’s in front of the camera whether it’s Susie or Nick; and there are times when you feel a chasm open behind them, and inside them. There are times when that feels like a legitimate expression, and there are times when it feels like I pushed them there. Any time that it felt like I pushed them there, I didn’t use it because it feels intrusive, and there’s something obscene about that. The reason that the painting is interesting to me is that it’s prophetic. It’s so odd that he painted a picture of the place that he died. But it’s Susie’s dilemma in that situation where she finds something that just knocks her over, and then she has to make a decision of whether to tell Nick. She’s got a choice. She either knocks Nick over, or the two of them are isolated. She has to make a decision. That seemed to me something that was really visceral about the experience of being grief-stricken that was contained in that story. That was the reason for its inclusion. Stuff where they’re just emotional…well, that’s where I feel stuff is just Barbara Walters-ish.”
How do you view Nick now, compared to when you thought of him as something of an idol? “Nick and I have been friends for a while, so to me, he’s just Nick. I understand that there’s the God-like Nick, and then there’s the scared little guy at the microphone. He’s a human being, and he’s got a character. And he’s both things. What I feel mostly for Nick is a real respect. Nick is a very generous person; he’s a prickly person, but he’s giving to his audience. He’s quite brave in the way that he’s prepared to share his experience with life, and not just the parts that make him look good. He’s living an examined life, and he allows other people access to it through his art. He’s a really strong person. I really admire him.”
Do you plan on working with Nick down the line? “Yeah, on any film where I need music…after the experience that I had with Jesse James…that music is just so good. He owes me…him and Warren!”
Would you consider making more documentaries? “Maybe. I only made this because he asked me to. Nick basically reckons that he’s never going to do another interview in his life. Whether he’ll be able to manage that, I don’t know. But he doesn’t like doing it.”
How did you prepare for your interviews for the film? “I had certain things that I wanted to know about, and I asked him about that. I interviewed him once for Interview Magazine. He asked me to do that. We have a relationship where we like to talk. If I get on the phone with Nick, we generally stay on the phone for two hours and talk about things. Nick will basically answer any question that I ask him, and he’s always been like that with me. That’s why he asked me to do this. He had things that he actually wanted to say because there had been a huge outpouring of support for him from all kinds of people who had written letters to him. He found it moving. Anyone who has suffered a loss like this really understands what he’s going through, and people reached out, and all of them found it incredibly helpful. As a result of that, he did feel like he wanted to tell people who cared how he was. And this was a way to do it. He just didn’t want to tell people who didn’t care. You do interviews, right, and a certain percentage of people like the film and they’re happy to be there and talk to you. And then there are other people who are just doing a job. They don’t like your film or didn’t think it was that good, but they have to write something. You encounter a certain amount of people who have an agenda. They have a story that they already want to write, and they want to fit you into that story. They’re just looking for quotes that are going to be able to tell that story. That’s just par for the course. But to be in his situation and talk about something that’s incredibly painful, difficult and personal, there’s no way that you want to do that.”
There weren’t any questions that he wouldn’t answer? “No. He’ll answer the question. There’s only a certain amount that he can tell you because there’s only a certain amount that he knows. The real feeling is not one of sadness or one of anger, it’s this incredible feeling of emptiness. He talks about it as a trauma, and that’s really what it is. I was dealing with someone damaged and in a state of shock. It was interesting when he first starts talking about Arthur; the only way that he can do it is in this abstract way where he’s relating it to songwriting…he can’t talk about it directly. But then as time goes on, he starts to just talk about it. It’s like the wound itself is so big that he has to come at it from a great distance. He can tell you what he can tell you, but he himself has not absorbed the blow. He has not been able to create some story around it that contains it or encapsulates it in the same way that you can when you’re talking about a song or some other experience. I hope what the film manages to do is to express that confusion. That it isn’t resolved. I love that thing he says about time being elastic, that it’s an event that you can get away from but it always keeps coming back.”
It’s going to be one of those things that he thinks about every day… “My girlfriend lost her mother when she was eleven. She’s nearly thirty now, and every year is this constant stream of anniversaries… Christmas, her mother’s birthday, her mother’s death. Close to twenty years later, it is still something that causes her a tremendous amount of pain. There are certain losses that you just don’t get over. As your capacity for pain enlarges, so does your capacity for love and joy as well. It doesn’t kill it. It does make everything more extreme or stronger.”
One More Time With Feeling screens around Australia on September 8. For all session, venue, and ticketing information on One More Time With Feeling, head to the official site.